Differences between Epiphone Dot and Studio?

[DougA]

Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons to buy
one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check before I buy one?
Do any pros play these?

[Ed Maier]

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons
to buy one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check
before I buy one?

The Studio has no fretboard markers, for one.

Post by DougA
Do any pros play these?

Doug, is that really important? I own two guitars that I love, and I'm
reasonably sure no pro plays those models on stage.

Ed Maier

[DougA]

Post by Ed Maier
The Studio has no fretboard markers, for one.

Not even on the sides of the neck?

Post by Ed Maier

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons
to buy one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check
before I buy one?

The Studio has no fretboard markers, for one.

Post by DougA
Do any pros play these?

Doug, is that really important? I own two guitars that I love, and I'm
reasonably sure no pro plays those models on stage.
Ed Maier

[Ed Maier]

Post by DougA

Post by Ed Maier
The Studio has no fretboard markers, for one.

Not even on the sides of the neck?

I found a Harmony Central review that said the fret markers *were* on
the side of the neck.

Ed Maier

[Derek]

I can't think of any pros who play late model epi 335's, however, that
doesn't mean there aren't any. The Studio is a less expensive model
due to cosmetics mostly.

In addition to no dots on the board, the finish choices and quality is
quite a bit different. The pups are uncovered also, and it appears
they have gone slightly cheaper with hardware.

[Lumpy]

Post by Derek
I can't think of any pros who play
late model epi 335's, however, that
doesn't mean there aren't any...

When I played professionally I was usually on
a $239 Ovation. Tommy T was often on a $75 Yamaha nylon.


Lumpy

In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

[Les Cargill]

Post by Lumpy

Post by Derek
I can't think of any pros who play
late model epi 335's, however, that
doesn't mean there aren't any...

When I played professionally I was usually on
a $239 Ovation. Tommy T was often on a $75 Yamaha nylon.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

Lumpy, maybe you know. Who played guitar on the
various Eastwood spaghetti Western Morricone
soundtracks - "The Good The Bad And The Ugly",
"Fistful", etcetera?

Was that Tedesco?

--
Les Cargill

[Lumpy]

Post by Les Cargill
Lumpy, maybe you know. Who played guitar on the
various Eastwood spaghetti Western Morricone
soundtracks - "The Good The Bad And The Ugly",
"Fistful", etcetera?
Was that Tedesco?

It was typically either Tommy, or Howard Roberts
or Laurindo Almeida. Sometimes more than one
guitarist was "officially" on the call.

Also, it was VERY common for anyone to sit in
for someone else. If Tommy was outside smoking
(he was a lot) someone else in the hallway might
step in and play his part. Then while THAT guy
was tied up doing Tommy's part, they might need
someone to replace that guy in his original
slot so someone else (maybe even Tommy) would
jump in and do that.

I was usually in another part of the building
(at Capitol) where they did commercials (smaller
studios). But sometimes even I would sit in for
some of the other guys in the big rooms. Generally
commercials were more hectic. You play more on
commercials. On movies and TV there is a HUGE
amount of sitting around, waiting.

And it wasn't uncommon at all for ANY musician to
add one note or one chord months later. Maybe the
original three notes were played stacatto but months
later the producer decided he wanted them
played legato. So they'd grab the closest union
musician and have them play just those three notes
legato instead of stacatto.


Lumpy

In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

[Les Cargill]

Post by Lumpy

Post by Les Cargill
Lumpy, maybe you know. Who played guitar on the
various Eastwood spaghetti Western Morricone
soundtracks - "The Good The Bad And The Ugly",
"Fistful", etcetera?
Was that Tedesco?

It was typically either Tommy, or Howard Roberts
or Laurindo Almeida. Sometimes more than one
guitarist was "officially" on the call.
Also, it was VERY common for anyone to sit in
for someone else. If Tommy was outside smoking
(he was a lot) someone else in the hallway might
step in and play his part. Then while THAT guy
was tied up doing Tommy's part, they might need
someone to replace that guy in his original
slot so someone else (maybe even Tommy) would
jump in and do that.

Wow - total tag team, eh?

Post by Lumpy
I was usually in another part of the building
(at Capitol) where they did commercials (smaller
studios). But sometimes even I would sit in for
some of the other guys in the big rooms. Generally
commercials were more hectic. You play more on
commercials. On movies and TV there is a HUGE
amount of sitting around, waiting.
And it wasn't uncommon at all for ANY musician to
add one note or one chord months later. Maybe the
original three notes were played stacatto but months
later the producer decided he wanted them
played legato. So they'd grab the closest union
musician and have them play just those three notes
legato instead of stacatto.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

Great deposition. Thanks.

--
Les Cargill

[Charmed Snark]

On 31 Jul 2007, "Lumpy" <***@digitalcartography.com> wrote in
alt.guitar.beginner:

...

Post by Lumpy
I was usually in another part of the building
(at Capitol) where they did commercials (smaller
studios). But sometimes even I would sit in for
some of the other guys in the big rooms. Generally
commercials were more hectic. You play more on
commercials. On movies and TV there is a HUGE
amount of sitting around, waiting.
And it wasn't uncommon at all for ANY musician to
add one note or one chord months later. Maybe the
original three notes were played stacatto but months
later the producer decided he wanted them
played legato. So they'd grab the closest union
musician and have them play just those three notes
legato instead of stacatto.
Lumpy

Hey, maybe I can sign up and specialize in those "one note
fills/edits"! ;-)

Snark.

[E=Fb]

Post by Lumpy

Post by Les Cargill
Lumpy, maybe you know. Who played guitar on the
various Eastwood spaghetti Western Morricone
soundtracks - "The Good The Bad And The Ugly",
"Fistful", etcetera?
Was that Tedesco?

It was typically either Tommy, or Howard Roberts
or Laurindo Almeida. Sometimes more than one
guitarist was "officially" on the call.
Also, it was VERY common for anyone to sit in
for someone else. If Tommy was outside smoking
(he was a lot) someone else in the hallway might
step in and play his part. Then while THAT guy
was tied up doing Tommy's part, they might need
someone to replace that guy in his original
slot so someone else (maybe even Tommy) would
jump in and do that.
I was usually in another part of the building
(at Capitol) where they did commercials (smaller
studios). But sometimes even I would sit in for
some of the other guys in the big rooms. Generally
commercials were more hectic. You play more on
commercials. On movies and TV there is a HUGE
amount of sitting around, waiting.
And it wasn't uncommon at all for ANY musician to
add one note or one chord months later. Maybe the
original three notes were played stacatto but months
later the producer decided he wanted them
played legato. So they'd grab the closest union
musician and have them play just those three notes
legato instead of stacatto.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

That's really interesting stuff. About tv and stuff. I noodle on my guitar
while looking at the tv with the sound off. I played bits and stuff to
provide the background for the picture. It's fun and all that but it doesn't
sound much like what I'd put in a song. :)

I realized from your last paragraph that after playing a song hundreds of
times, it's not going to sound the same as the first time. ;-)

Ain't guitars fun?

[b***@hotmail.com]

Post by Derek
I can't think of any pros who play late model epi 335's, however, that
doesn't mean there aren't any. The Studio is a less expensive model
due to cosmetics mostly.
In addition to no dots on the board, the finish choices and quality is
quite a bit different. The pups are uncovered also, and it appears
they have gone slightly cheaper with hardware.

Right now at Musician's Friend, one model of the Studio (worn brown
$199) is half the price of the regular dot. The studio has uncovered
alnico pups, said to be hotter than the humbuckers on the Dot. No
pickguard, and there are single tone and volume controls compared to
the Dot's four knobs and pick-up selector.

Both are used by folks making money with them, usually with a pick-up
and wiring/knob upgrade. Dwight Yoakam uses an new Epiphone 335, but
not a Dot. I assume they started with an Elitest Casino model and did
whatever he wanted to it.

[Derek]

Post by Lumpy
When I played professionally I was usually on
a $239 Ovation. Tommy T was often on a $75 Yamaha nylon.

Yeah, but that was in the dark ages of studio work. How would those
prices adjust out now?

I fondly remember the TT articles in GP describing his various studio
gigs, and what kind of instrument and equipment he would use. An
amazing ability to be able to sit in and get it right first time when
the littel red light comes on.

[Lumpy]

Post by Derek

Post by Lumpy
When I played professionally I was usually on
a $239 Ovation. Tommy T was often on a $75 Yamaha nylon.

Yeah, but that was in the dark ages of studio work.
How would those prices adjust out now?

It would probably be whatever the cheapest Ovation is
today. I see $250 for one on BanjoFriend.

Cheapest Yamaha...I just helped someone buy one for $109.

It's the "destruction derby" of guitar playing. You play
them so much, you deliberately don't want something expensive
and cosmetically gorgeous. The major draw to the Ovies in
that setting was that they sounded consistant from guitar
to guitar.


Lumpy

In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

[Guncho]

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons to buy
one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check before I buy one?
Do any pros play these?

Gibson Studio or Epiphone?

If Epiphone, the major difference would be, one is semi hollow body
and the other is solid body.

Do pros use them? If by pro you mean cover band guitarist, then yes.
If you mean major label recording artist that not usually, no.

Chris

.

[Twang]

Post by Guncho

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons to buy
one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check before I buy one?
Do any pros play these?

Gibson Studio or Epiphone?
If Epiphone, the major difference would be, one is semi hollow body
and the other is solid body.
Do pros use them? If by pro you mean cover band guitarist, then yes.
If you mean major label recording artist that not usually, no.
Chris
.

I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.

I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.

the studio models have yet to make any appearance that I've seen. I
suspect it's only a matter of time.

I have the epi lp studio.. it's pretty much flawless, sounds and plays
very very good.
I chose it over the dot studio because in fact I could tell no
difference at all in the overall quality and the price was right..
adding that to the fact that I already have a sheraton and had no
paul.

I'd play it anywhere, proudly. because it's the sound and my playing
that count to me.

I like the cosmetics of the dot a lot better. They may have better
pickups.. but epis got some pretty darn good pups now, so it could be
a matter of personal taste as much as anything else.

TWANG

[Derek]

Post by Twang
I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.
I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.
the studio models have yet to make any appearance that I've seen. I
suspect it's only a matter of time.

Right. Live playing and touring is hard on high end equipment. This
is why so many save their tone monsters for studio work, and take
their more utilitarian instruments on the road.

There is a wonderful article in GP (?) this month about Andy Summers
and the Fender Tele AS model. He takes 4 of them on the road and
leaves the original at home. Same reason why bands from Weezer to
Megadeath have taken PODs on the road instead of all the amps.

In a live situation, you are not going to be able to replicate your
studio sound, but with decent equipment you should be able to get
close.

[Guncho]

Post by Derek

Post by Twang
I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.
I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.
the studio models have yet to make any appearance that I've seen. I
suspect it's only a matter of time.

Right. Live playing and touring is hard on high end equipment. This
is why so many save their tone monsters for studio work, and take
their more utilitarian instruments on the road.
There is a wonderful article in GP (?) this month about Andy Summers
and the Fender Tele AS model. He takes 4 of them on the road and
leaves the original at home. Same reason why bands from Weezer to
Megadeath have taken PODs on the road instead of all the amps.
In a live situation, you are not going to be able to replicate your
studio sound, but with decent equipment you should be able to get
close.

My experience is the exact opposite. When I go see major label
bands, they are playing expensive vintage gear a lot of the time.

Chris

[Derek]

Post by Guncho
My experience is the exact opposite. When I go see major label
bands, they are playing expensive vintage gear a lot of the time.

Hmm, other than maybe the amps, I sincerely doubt you get close enough
to see what guitars they are playing at a major show. Going back to
the 70's, I have seen dozens of concerts, and other than SRV and
Michael Hedges, I can't come up with an player (though I am sure there
were) who played their studio/vintage instruments live.

More often I see newer versions of what they have at home. In the
various magazine interviews they say as much. I am talking everything
from jazz to metal. Of course, not every player is attracted to
vintage instruments.

I don't recall Vai, Satriani, Petrucci, Van Halen, Pass, Montgomery,
Martino, Guy, et al playing or talking about vintage instruments.
Seems more of a tool to them to get at the sound they hear and want to
replicate.

[Guncho]

Post by Derek

Post by Guncho
My experience is the exact opposite. When I go see major label
bands, they are playing expensive vintage gear a lot of the time.

Hmm, other than maybe the amps, I sincerely doubt you get close enough
to see what guitars they are playing at a major show. Going back to
the 70's, I have seen dozens of concerts, and other than SRV and
Michael Hedges, I can't come up with an player (though I am sure there
were) who played their studio/vintage instruments live.
More often I see newer versions of what they have at home. In the
various magazine interviews they say as much. I am talking everything
from jazz to metal. Of course, not every player is attracted to
vintage instruments.
I don't recall Vai, Satriani, Petrucci, Van Halen, Pass, Montgomery,
Martino, Guy, et al playing or talking about vintage instruments.
Seems more of a tool to them to get at the sound they hear and want to
replicate.

http://www.sonymusic.com/artists/PearlJam/gear/index.html

[Derek]

http://www.sonymusic.com/artists/PearlJam/gear/index.html- Hide quoted text -

Didn't go to the link, but I remember an article a few years back on
them, along with a pic of the storage room they keep just guitars in.
It looked like the back room at Gruhn's, tons of vintage guitars.
They would certainly support your argument.

[Bob Mann]

Post by Guncho

Post by Derek

Post by Twang
I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.
I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.
the studio models have yet to make any appearance that I've seen. I
suspect it's only a matter of time.

Right. Live playing and touring is hard on high end equipment. This
is why so many save their tone monsters for studio work, and take
their more utilitarian instruments on the road.
There is a wonderful article in GP (?) this month about Andy Summers
and the Fender Tele AS model. He takes 4 of them on the road and
leaves the original at home. Same reason why bands from Weezer to
Megadeath have taken PODs on the road instead of all the amps.
In a live situation, you are not going to be able to replicate your
studio sound, but with decent equipment you should be able to get
close.

My experience is the exact opposite. When I go see major label
bands, they are playing expensive vintage gear a lot of the time.
Chris

I agree.
I'm fairly certain the Stones were using all their favourite vintage
stuff.
Some don't use vintage stuff at all but many do.
Also, if bands aren't using their good stuff, why do we hear about the
good stuff being roipped off?

[Lumpy]

Post by Bob Mann
I'm fairly certain the Stones were
using all their favourite vintage
stuff.

You sat close enough and have the expertise to
know the vintage of their instruments?


Lumpy

Will you do my answering machine message?
Yes. Who would you like people to think you are?

www.lumpyvoice.net

[Guncho]

Post by Twang

Post by Guncho

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons to buy
one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check before I buy one?
Do any pros play these?

Gibson Studio or Epiphone?
If Epiphone, the major difference would be, one is semi hollow body
and the other is solid body.
Do pros use them? If by pro you mean cover band guitarist, then yes.
If you mean major label recording artist that not usually, no.
Chris
.

I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.
I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.

Not in my opinion.

99% of the time when I see a major label guitarist playing a 335 style
guitar, it's a Gibson.

Chris

[Jim]

Post by Guncho

Post by Twang

Post by Guncho

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons to buy
one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check before I buy one?
Do any pros play these?

Gibson Studio or Epiphone?
If Epiphone, the major difference would be, one is semi hollow body
and the other is solid body.
Do pros use them? If by pro you mean cover band guitarist, then yes.
If you mean major label recording artist that not usually, no.
Chris
.

I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.
I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.

Not in my opinion.
99% of the time when I see a major label guitarist playing a 335 style
guitar, it's a Gibson.
Chris

I see "cheaper" guitars used far more than 1% of the time with major
label bands.

But who cares? What's the point? Those guys have different resources
and different needs.

My advice for the "average Joe," when it comes to choosing a guitar:

Play everything that you can get your hands one, even high dollar
vintage and "custom shop" types. Even guitars you think you don't like.

Step One: Decide what model YOU like. Let's assume that happens to be
335 style, to keep with this thread.

Next, play the $2,000 Gibsons, the $1,300 Epiphone Elitists, the $400
Epiphone DOT, the $250 Epiphone DOT Studio, and all "knock offs" you can
find. ...and all the used models of the above that you can find.

Next, decide what plays best in your hands. Look at the price tag of
the "best" one. Is it a $5,000 vintage guitar? Is it a $1300 Elitist?
Are either worth that much to you?

Keep this in mind: for a little extra money, a good luthier can do his
magic on the neck of any guitar at any price level (level, crown and
polish). ...and for a few extra bucks you could put pickups of your
choice on the guitar.

THEN decide what makes the most sense to you and your wallet. If you
are the type of guy that values the Gibson label, then factor that in as
well.

When I did the above in real life, I bought a Washburn Oscar Schmidt
OE30 (Delta King) and ended up having a luthier do a level crown and
polish. Stock pickups are a bit hot, but actually do blues grit BETTER
than stock Gibson. I won't bore you with the lengthy story, but for
LESS than the cost of an Epi Studio (which weren't offered at this
time), I got a great playing and sounding guitar. If it was my daily
player, I would've insisted on a set neck (this model is bolt on, the
heel is a couple frets higher if that matters to you). But honestly,
after the custom luthier work, it plays great.

Here she is: Loading Image...

Caveat: This model is now made in China in a different factory.

[Guncho]

Post by Jim

Post by Guncho

Post by Twang

Post by Guncho

Post by DougA
Could someone point out any differences in sound, quality or reasons to buy
one over the other? Anything need to be replaced or check before I buy one?
Do any pros play these?

Gibson Studio or Epiphone?
If Epiphone, the major difference would be, one is semi hollow body
and the other is solid body.
Do pros use them? If by pro you mean cover band guitarist, then yes.
If you mean major label recording artist that not usually, no.
Chris
.

I can't remember how many times I've seen bands on letterman leno and
the rest playing casinos, dots and sheratons.
I can remember that it was way way more than gibsons.
I don't understand this question coming up so often. These are pro
instruments.

Not in my opinion.
99% of the time when I see a major label guitarist playing a 335 style
guitar, it's a Gibson.
Chris

I see "cheaper" guitars used far more than 1% of the time with major
label bands.
But who cares? What's the point? Those guys have different resources
and different needs.
Play everything that you can get your hands one, even high dollar
vintage and "custom shop" types. Even guitars you think you don't like.
Step One: Decide what model YOU like. Let's assume that happens to be
335 style, to keep with this thread.
Next, play the $2,000 Gibsons, the $1,300 Epiphone Elitists, the $400
Epiphone DOT, the $250 Epiphone DOT Studio, and all "knock offs" you can
find. ...and all the used models of the above that you can find.
Next, decide what plays best in your hands. Look at the price tag of
the "best" one. Is it a $5,000 vintage guitar? Is it a $1300 Elitist?
Are either worth that much to you?
Keep this in mind: for a little extra money, a good luthier can do his
magic on the neck of any guitar at any price level (level, crown and
polish). ...and for a few extra bucks you could put pickups of your
choice on the guitar.
THEN decide what makes the most sense to you and your wallet. If you
are the type of guy that values the Gibson label, then factor that in as
well.
When I did the above in real life, I bought a Washburn Oscar Schmidt
OE30 (Delta King) and ended up having a luthier do a level crown and
polish. Stock pickups are a bit hot, but actually do blues grit BETTER
than stock Gibson. I won't bore you with the lengthy story, but for
LESS than the cost of an Epi Studio (which weren't offered at this
time), I got a great playing and sounding guitar. If it was my daily
player, I would've insisted on a set neck (this model is bolt on, the
heel is a couple frets higher if that matters to you). But honestly,
after the custom luthier work, it plays great.
Here she is: http://www.seattle-attorney.com/OE30.jpg
Caveat: This model is now made in China in a different factory.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -

This is excellent advice but is also assuming that the person trying
the guitars has played guitar long enough to hear the difference from
one guitar to the next.

ie I'm imagining my girlfriend trying guitars and deciding on one
simply because it's red.

Chris

[JeffinMS]

When I did the above in real life, I bought a Washburn Oscar Schmidt OE30
(Delta King) and ended up having a luthier do a level crown and polish.
Stock pickups are a bit hot, but actually do blues grit BETTER than stock
Gibson. I won't bore you with the lengthy story, but for LESS than the
cost of an Epi Studio (which weren't offered at this time), I got a great
playing and sounding guitar. If it was my daily player, I would've
insisted on a set neck (this model is bolt on, the heel is a couple frets
higher if that matters to you). But honestly, after the custom luthier
work, it plays great.
Here she is: http://www.seattle-attorney.com/OE30.jpg
Caveat: This model is now made in China in a different factory.

My brother just bought one of these about a month ago from Music123 in black
as no one else seems to carry them anymore and black was the only color
option available. $129.00 and he says the biggest piece of shit he ever
spent $129 on. Our local Music Go ROund just had one on sale for $59, should
have bought it. Would have if I didnt already have the Epi Wildkat and
Ibanez Artcore.

[Lumpy]

Am I the only one confused by the fact that
the "Epiphone Dot Studio" doesn't have dots?

Maybe Habib can sell us some dots.


Lumpy

In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

[Les Cargill]

Post by Lumpy
Am I the only one confused by the fact that
the "Epiphone Dot Studio" doesn't have dots?

Its a cross product, not a dot product.

Post by Lumpy
Maybe Habib can sell us some dots.
Lumpy
In Your Ears for 40 Years
www.lumpymusic.com

--
Les Cargill

[Ed Maier]

Post by Les Cargill

Post by Lumpy
Am I the only one confused by the fact that
the "Epiphone Dot Studio" doesn't have dots?

Its a cross product, not a dot product.

(Folger's on my keyboard)

Ed Maier