Discussion:
Circle of fifths as a chord progression generator (repost)
(too old to reply)
Stephen Calder
2005-12-01 22:37:51 UTC
Permalink
Circle of Fifths as a chord progression generator


The circle has a variety of uses, and one of them is in constructing
chord progressions. Let's have a look at the cycle written out:

F C G D A E B Gb Db Ab Eb Bb (then back to the start) F C G etc

You can remember the sequence with a mnemonic, for example Fanny Crosby
Goes Daffy After Eating Bananas (with the Goes Daffy up to the end
repeated and flats added).

Remember that Gb=F# and so on. If you look at where G is in the cycle,
you will notice that the three most important chords in the key of G,
are grouped together with the subdominant (C) on one side and the
dominant (D) on the other. The same applies to any other key, for
example, C, in which key the most important chords are F, C and G.

In the beginning of the jazz era, it was also discovered that the cycle
of fifths led to some pretty interesting, and at the time, novel chord
progressions. The idea is to start on the tonic chord of the key you're
in (let's say it's C) and jump as many times forward as you want around
the cycle to another chord, let's suppose we decided it would be A. Now
you follow the cycle backwards (making it a cycle of fourths) and you
get, for example,

C | A7 | D7 | G7 | C|


I don't know if that sequence is familiar to you, but it turns up in
lots of songs, for example:

Missed the Saturday [C]dance, heard they crowded the [A7]floor
Couldn't bear it with[D7]out you, [G7] don't get around much any[C]more.

[G] [E7] No girl made has got a shade on sweet Georgia Brown
[A7] Crazy feet that dance so neat has sweet Georgia Brown
[D7] they all sigh and wanna die for Sweet Georgia Brown
[D7] I tell you just [G] why [D7] you know I don't [G] lie


Notice that sevenths are used for the run back to the start, and this is
often (but not always) the case. In these examples we jumped three steps
forward on the wheel, but you can jump just two, or as many as you want.
The longest jump in a cycle-of-fifths progression of this type I have
seen is in another standard, "Someone to Watch Over Me." Also in the key
of C, where the song jumps five steps to B(7) before making its way
round the circle backwards to C:

[C]Although he [F]may not be the man some
Girls think of as [C]handsome
To [B7]my heart he [E7] carries the [A7]key [D7] [G7] [C]

An interesting point about these progressions is that you can write
melodies around them without ever leaving the diatonic scale of the
tonic key (C, in this case). Another way of saying this is that although
the chords themselves may contain notes that are not in the key of C,
the melodies they accompany often use only the notes in the C scale.

The common progression C-Am-Dm-G-C used in innumerable 60s hits (eg the
Four Seasons' Sherry) is also a variation on the cycle of fifths, using
minor chords instead of sevenths for the A and D.

Once you know about this common progression, you start seeing variations
on it everywhere and you begin to see how prevalent it is in 20th
century popular music. This can help when trying to work out chord
progressions by ear. The cycle is something you can try when all else
fails. Eventually you become familiar with the sound of a
cycle-of-fifths progression. But beware. They don't all sound the same
by any means. Depending on how far you jump and whether you use sevenths
or minor chords to get back, and how often you do it, these progressions
can sound surprisingly different from each other, which is probably one
reason why they became so popular. Almost every major pop and rock
composer, including the Beatles, used the cycle of fifths to generate
chord progressions.

Some other examples:

Dancing Cheek to Cheek Gmaj7 E7 Am7 D7 Gmaj7
Crazy C A7 Dm G7 C
All of Me G B7 E7 Am B7 Em A7 Am7 D7 G


Paul McCartney, not without precedent, radically changed the nature of
the progression by going from the tonic, not to the chord three steps
away but the chord based on the note a semitone below, then stepping up
a half-tone to the cycle before continuing, in this song:

[F]Honey Pie, you are making me [Db]crazy, [D7] I'm in love but I'm
[G7lazy [C7] So won't you please come [F]home.


It's called the cycle, or circle of fifths, because the interval from C
to G (one step forward on the circle) is known as a fifth (derived from
the fact that G is the fifth note in the key of C, counting C as 1). A
fifth (also known as a perfect fifth, not sharpened to an augmented
fifth or flattened to a diminished fifth) is always 7 semitones.

Going in the other direction (right to left or counterclockwise), we are
moving in steps of a perfect fourth (five semitones) at a time, so the
cycle of fifths becomes a cycle of fourths.
--
Stephen
Lennox Head, Australia
JustinT
2005-12-01 23:50:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Calder
Circle of Fifths as a chord progression generator
The circle has a variety of uses, and one of them is in constructing chord
F C G D A E B Gb Db Ab Eb Bb (then back to the start) F C G etc
<excellent post snipped>

Stephen

I once read an article about using the circle of fifths for chord
progressions, but didn't really follow it that well. Your post makes the
whole thing perfectly clear.

I've been struggling a bit to find fresh sounding chord progressions in my
practice ... so this could well be the ticket! Thanks for taking the
trouble.

Justin
Dan
2005-12-02 00:13:31 UTC
Permalink
My instructor wants me to pick a couple of songs, figure out what major
key each is in and then play minor scales with them. Initially, he simply
wants me to play a minor scale pattern in time with the beat. Then he said
to begin improvising by using my ear to work within the pattern so it sounds
good and/or to simply work out solos.
I appreciate the links you've all posted. I've checked all of them out
and I've learned from the sites. Right now this is all a wee bit
overwhelming. But I'm hanging on. (I'll never give up!) I just figured
out where to play the 5 patterns of the major scale in A, B, C, D, E, F & G.
This evening I made a chart that shows what fret each pattern starts on.
One great thing is that the 5 patterns never change. The only thing that
changes is which fret to start on. The Circle of 5's shows me which
relative minor keys to play scale patterns in. Right now, that seems to be
the most important
thing for me to know at this stage of the game. Now I've got to quit making
charts and start practicing! Lol. Thanks again. Dan
Hippy
2005-12-02 00:18:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by JustinT
Post by Stephen Calder
The circle has a variety of uses, and one of them is in constructing chord
F C G D A E B Gb Db Ab Eb Bb (then back to the start) F C G etc
<excellent post snipped>
Stephen
I once read an article about using the circle of fifths for chord
progressions, but didn't really follow it that well. Your post makes the
whole thing perfectly clear.
I've been struggling a bit to find fresh sounding chord progressions in my
practice ... so this could well be the ticket! Thanks for taking the
trouble.
Justin
Yes thanks for your time as it clears some things up for me too...definitely
a keeper
Thanks Stephen
~Hippy
Stephen Calder
2005-12-02 01:03:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Hippy
Post by JustinT
Justin
Yes thanks for your time as it clears some things up for me too...definitely
a keeper
Thanks Stephen
~Hippy
Thanks, my pleasure.
--
Stephen
Lennox Head, Australia
Stephen Calder
2005-12-02 01:01:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Calder
Stephen
I once read an article about using the circle of fifths for chord
progressions, but didn't really follow it that well. Your post makes the
whole thing perfectly clear.
I've been struggling a bit to find fresh sounding chord progressions in my
practice ... so this could well be the ticket! Thanks for taking the
trouble.
Justin
Thanks for the feedback, glad you found it useful.
--
Stephen
Lennox Head, Australia
RockaBilly
2005-12-02 11:32:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Calder
Circle of Fifths as a chord progression generator
The circle has a variety of uses, and one of them is in constructing
F C G D A E B Gb Db Ab Eb Bb (then back to the start) F C G etc
You can remember the sequence with a mnemonic, for example Fanny Crosby
Goes Daffy After Eating Bananas (with the Goes Daffy up to the end
repeated and flats added).
Remember that Gb=F# and so on. If you look at where G is in the cycle,
you will notice that the three most important chords in the key of G,
are grouped together with the subdominant (C) on one side and the
dominant (D) on the other. The same applies to any other key, for
example, C, in which key the most important chords are F, C and G.
In the beginning of the jazz era, it was also discovered that the cycle
of fifths led to some pretty interesting, and at the time, novel chord
progressions. The idea is to start on the tonic chord of the key you're
in (let's say it's C) and jump as many times forward as you want around
the cycle to another chord, let's suppose we decided it would be A. Now
you follow the cycle backwards (making it a cycle of fourths) and you
get, for example,
C | A7 | D7 | G7 | C|
I don't know if that sequence is familiar to you, but it turns up in
Missed the Saturday [C]dance, heard they crowded the [A7]floor
Couldn't bear it with[D7]out you, [G7] don't get around much any[C]more.
[G] [E7] No girl made has got a shade on sweet Georgia Brown
[A7] Crazy feet that dance so neat has sweet Georgia Brown
[D7] they all sigh and wanna die for Sweet Georgia Brown
[D7] I tell you just [G] why [D7] you know I don't [G] lie
Notice that sevenths are used for the run back to the start, and this is
often (but not always) the case. In these examples we jumped three steps
forward on the wheel, but you can jump just two, or as many as you want.
The longest jump in a cycle-of-fifths progression of this type I have
seen is in another standard, "Someone to Watch Over Me." Also in the key
of C, where the song jumps five steps to B(7) before making its way
[C]Although he [F]may not be the man some
Girls think of as [C]handsome
To [B7]my heart he [E7] carries the [A7]key [D7] [G7] [C]
An interesting point about these progressions is that you can write
melodies around them without ever leaving the diatonic scale of the
tonic key (C, in this case). Another way of saying this is that although
the chords themselves may contain notes that are not in the key of C,
the melodies they accompany often use only the notes in the C scale.
The common progression C-Am-Dm-G-C used in innumerable 60s hits (eg the
Four Seasons' Sherry) is also a variation on the cycle of fifths, using
minor chords instead of sevenths for the A and D.
Once you know about this common progression, you start seeing variations
on it everywhere and you begin to see how prevalent it is in 20th
century popular music. This can help when trying to work out chord
progressions by ear. The cycle is something you can try when all else
fails. Eventually you become familiar with the sound of a
cycle-of-fifths progression. But beware. They don't all sound the same
by any means. Depending on how far you jump and whether you use sevenths
or minor chords to get back, and how often you do it, these progressions
can sound surprisingly different from each other, which is probably one
reason why they became so popular. Almost every major pop and rock
composer, including the Beatles, used the cycle of fifths to generate
chord progressions.
Dancing Cheek to Cheek Gmaj7 E7 Am7 D7 Gmaj7
Crazy C A7 Dm G7 C
All of Me G B7 E7 Am B7 Em A7 Am7 D7 G
Paul McCartney, not without precedent, radically changed the nature of
the progression by going from the tonic, not to the chord three steps
away but the chord based on the note a semitone below, then stepping up
[F]Honey Pie, you are making me [Db]crazy, [D7] I'm in love but I'm
[G7lazy [C7] So won't you please come [F]home.
It's called the cycle, or circle of fifths, because the interval from C
to G (one step forward on the circle) is known as a fifth (derived from
the fact that G is the fifth note in the key of C, counting C as 1). A
fifth (also known as a perfect fifth, not sharpened to an augmented
fifth or flattened to a diminished fifth) is always 7 semitones.
Going in the other direction (right to left or counterclockwise), we are
moving in steps of a perfect fourth (five semitones) at a time, so the
cycle of fifths becomes a cycle of fourths.
--
Stephen
Lennox Head, Australia
Excellent post Stephen. The circle of fifths are very interesting stuff to
play with. There are so many ways to use it but here's my favorite. Here's
the formula:

IV-I-V-ii-vi-iii-vii-bV

This is where you'll find the notes of the scale on the circle of fifths
when you chose a key anywhere on the circle of fifths. The closer the note
is to the tonic (key) the more consonant it is. The more further from the
tonic the more dissonant. Same with chords.

See the bV? It's known as the tritone but it's what we called a blue note.
:)

As chords the uppercase means major and the lowercase means minor but the
vii is diminished (minor with a flatted fifth).

Enjoy!
David Raleigh Arnold
2005-12-02 16:19:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Calder
Circle of Fifths as a chord progression generator
The circle has a variety of uses,
It is nothing more than an extension of the tonic-dominant relationship.
The 5th note of a scale is the dominant, or V. The chord change V7 to
I is called a cadence. Harmony based on that relationship is called
functional harmony. The circle of fifths is V7 to I->V7. IOW, you
substitute a dominant seventh on the same root for the tonic of each
cadence and just keep going.

There are other ways to use cadences. For
example, take the first notes of a scale: C D E and the
dominant of each G C A7 D B7 Em as in 'We Wish You a Merry Xmas'

I think it is more useful to take a more general approach. daveA
--
Free download of technical exercises worth a lifetime of practice:
"Dynamic Guitar Technique": http://www.openguitar.com/instruction.html
email: "David Raleigh Arnold" <***@openguitar.com>|<***@cox.net>
(Full name in address field is needed to pass filter)
Kernix
2005-12-02 18:54:23 UTC
Permalink
Nice post. Love talking about music. It's amazing how many different
things you can discover. You can never stop learning.

Another thing you might want to consider doing, is printing out the
circle (or drawing your own), then put each keys relative minor
directly below the key inside the circle: Am below C, Em below, G, etc.


What you get is (starting from C major moving clockwise) Am, Em, Bm,
F#m, C#m, G#m, D#m \ Ebm, A#m \ Bbm, Fm, Cm, Gm, Dm and then back to Am
- moving in 5ths just like the majors. The diminished chords do the
same - I put them outside the circle on top of the key letters.

The movement of 5ths for minor chords isn't as strong as dominant 7ths,
but it still has the tendency. Going with the example above of going
from C to A7 and working your way back, you could do the same - C - F#m
- Bm - Em - Am - C, or switching between minors and their relative
majors: C - A7 - Bm7 - G7 - Am7 - C.

Then of course there's always 1/2 step substitutions & dom7 tritone
subs.

I've recently been working trying to find as many chords as possible
that have at least 2-3 notes in common with a simple chord like a
Cmaj7, C7, Cm7 etc - at least the 3rd and 7th of the chord. I found
that an Ab7#5#9 has a C, E, & B in it. It's a different sounding chord
that fits in nice for the IV in G major. The voicing is pretty easy too
assuming you know how to hold the classic 7#9 chord. You just use the
pinky that's holding the #9 to bar the 1st and second strings -Ab7#5#9
=> x11 10 11 12 12

Jim
Stephen Calder
2005-12-02 21:04:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Kernix
Nice post. Love talking about music. It's amazing how many different
things you can discover. You can never stop learning.
Another thing you might want to consider doing, is printing out the
circle (or drawing your own), then put each keys relative minor
directly below the key inside the circle: Am below C, Em below, G, etc.
What you get is (starting from C major moving clockwise) Am, Em, Bm,
F#m, C#m, G#m, D#m \ Ebm, A#m \ Bbm, Fm, Cm, Gm, Dm and then back to Am
- moving in 5ths just like the majors. The diminished chords do the
same - I put them outside the circle on top of the key letters.
The movement of 5ths for minor chords isn't as strong as dominant 7ths,
but it still has the tendency. Going with the example above of going
from C to A7 and working your way back, you could do the same - C - F#m
- Bm - Em - Am - C, or switching between minors and their relative
majors: C - A7 - Bm7 - G7 - Am7 - C.
Then of course there's always 1/2 step substitutions & dom7 tritone
subs.
I've recently been working trying to find as many chords as possible
that have at least 2-3 notes in common with a simple chord like a
Cmaj7, C7, Cm7 etc - at least the 3rd and 7th of the chord. I found
that an Ab7#5#9 has a C, E, & B in it. It's a different sounding chord
that fits in nice for the IV in G major. The voicing is pretty easy too
assuming you know how to hold the classic 7#9 chord. You just use the
pinky that's holding the #9 to bar the 1st and second strings -Ab7#5#9
=> x11 10 11 12 12
Jim
Good input, thanks.
--
Stephen
Lennox Head, Australia
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